Getting to hear from Suggs
We've talked about the Brandon Marshall trade rumors. We've discussed the recent roster cuts and the signing of draft picks. We've looked at Michael Vick possibly making an NFL comeback, and a number of notes from offseason minicamps.
But of all the Ravens-themed topics that have been touched on over the last few weeks, Terrell Suggs' contract negotiations have not really been part of the discussion.
The Ravens put the franchise tag on Sizzle for the second straight season, meaning Baltimore has locked him in for a one-year, $10.2 million contract, but because Suggs has yet to sign the tender, GM Ozzie Newsome is still hoping to work out a long-term deal with him.
The three-time Pro Bowl LB/DE has shied away from the media spotlight since the Ravens slapped the tag on him back in February, but tonight we'll get to hear his thoughts on the situation first-hand. Sizzle is scheduled to appear as an in-studio guest analyst on NFL Total Access, which airs on the NFL Network at 7 p.m.
I'm sure Suggs will be asked about the contract talks and his feelings about being given the tag yet again, and I'm sure we'll want to listen.
Sizzle is one of the more charismatic players in the NFL and he always speaks his mind, so I'm interested to hear what he has to say about where things stand between him and the Ravens.
The Baltimore brass have said they would love to keep Suggs in the Purple and Black for years to come, but it's clear the 26-year-old Arizona State product is intent on working out a monster contract that would make him one of the highest-paid defensive players in the league.
Ozzie will be willing to dish out a nice chunk of change, but if Suggs is looking for the same type of money Redskins defensive tackle Albert Haynesworth got this offseason ($100 million over seven years with $41 mil guaranteed), he'll probably end up stuck with that one-year franchise tender.
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Categories (click for archive)Dan Kolko | Ravens News |
Glad you wrote about this, Dan. Suggs pulled this crap last offseason...avoiding workouts, yet going on NFL Network to run his mouth. If I am not mistaken (you, Dan, would know if I am right seeing how you are close to the team), we have offered him close to Jared Allen type money several times. In my opinion, while he is a good player, he isn't worth that amount. We have pass rushers on this team who want to be there working out, and I say let them play. Paul Kruger could be really special this season, and a guy like Antwan Barnes may step up big time. If Suggs wants to continue to act this selfishly, then screw him. Sometimes, you have to let players walk who think they are being disrespected, which is insane seeing how Suggs' pay would be a whopping $10.2 million. With a lot of people suffering because of the economy, he wants to quibble over millions of dollars...millions that have been on the table for him to accept. This should not be indicative of the Ravens' way.
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Josh,
To me, the question is how bad Suggs wants to stay in Baltimore. He'll get his money somewhere, but the Ravens have been more than fair with him, and soon, it will be time for Sizzle to decide which is more important to him: remaining a Raven for quite a while and getting a good amount of cash at the same time, or grabbing a monster deal and going elsewhere to get it.
-Dan
Josh, it seems you have a lot of unwarranted aggression stored up against Suggs. Ultimately, he is one of the best defensive players in the league and he is proven, unlike the people you are hoping would step up. He should get paid and he should be paid fairly. It isn't like the team is making no money off of his play and the sale of his jersey and other such things. We also don't know the terms of a long term contract that are being discussed, so we can't say for sure what the discrepancy would be.
Correct me if I'm wrong though, but wasn't it Suggs that suggested before the off-season that Scott, Lewis and himself should all consider taking a pay cut to stay together? That just doesn't sound like the kind of selfish behavior you're accusing him of.
I really hope he doesn't bash the team and start saying they haven't offered him a good enough deal. I obviously dont know how the negotiations have gone, but as you said Dan, I'm sure Ozzie has been fair. Let's hope he says a deal is almost done.
Uh, Chris,
I do not have any pent up aggression towards Suggs. And you proved my point when mentioning Suggs' comments regarding a "hometown discount" between he, Ray and Scott. Ray has already been inked, and Suggs has not. And why? Because he wants outrageous money...more than he is worth, in my opinion. And remember, these are just my views. If you think him refusing Jared Allen type money several times (which I think is true) is okay, then fine. I feel it is counter productive, and does nothing to help the team. I acknowledge that he is still young, and you cannot put a premium on a good pass rusher. And that's what I feel he is...a good pass rusher. And to your point that he should be paid fairly, the money has been there on the table that is more than fair. No way was he serious when he said he and the other two LBs would take a "hometown discount," unless he is upset that Bart walked away...which would just be dumb. So, what is he doing? For the second year in a row, he will be going on TV to publicly discuss his contract situation. And where is the productivity in that? Our team is on the verge of something special this season...and he should be there to be a part of it.
Josh,
How can you say the pay cut statement proves your point? He was making an effort to keep the team the way it was, showing that he can be a team player. Then later you say that he was in no way serious about that statement and was possibly just mad because Bart walked away...what??? He made that statement long before Bart went to the Jets. How could he have been mad about something that hadn't happened yet? Your logic is befuddling.
Furthermore, you can't say that he's going on the show to specifically talk about that situation. Like it says above, he's going on as a guest analyst and yes, he'll probably be asked about the situation, just like Ray Lewis was asked about his situation back during the ProBowl week. But, you saying that "he will be going on TV to publicly discuss his contract situation" is not 100% correct. He's there as a guest. What they ask him is up to them.
Now, would I love to have him in camp right now? Yes. 100%. But if they're trying to negotiate a contract and since he is currently not signed, why would he want to put himself at risk and possibly injure himself? You don't go to work for free, why would you expect him to? And you don't know if the contract quibbles are over money or years or clauses or what, so you can't automatically say he's greedy and he just wants more money. Maybe he wants more security. Money is not always the issue.
Uh, Chris, your comment "Maybe he wants more security. Money is not always the issue" is a little confusing. This is a guy who will make over $10m this year. Made over $8m last year. Any long term contract will likely pay him at least $8m/year for a lotta years, with a fair bit of that money guaranteed. And he will undoubtedly have some sort of insurance to guard against a career ending injury. If $8-10m/year isn't "secure" enough for someone, then... well, I am at a loss for words.
I have written several times on this blog that Ozzie should be signing Suggs to long term contract before he goes out and gets a big name free agent like Marshall or Burress. He can assume the leadership of this defense after Ray retires in a few years. If we can't sign him, if he won't accept the a similar deal that Bart Scott got from the Jets (maybe a little sweeter given their age difference and Sizzle's speed), then we made a mistake in keeping him and not Bart. Terrell should get paid a lot of money, he should be one of the top paid people on the team, but he's got to think about the team too. He wouldn't be in the position he's in without the team. They need each other, in the same way Ray and the team need each other. All is IMHO of course.
Chris,
You are still missing the point. No one in their right mind should think Suggs meant what he said when he claimed he, Ray and Bart would take a hometown discount to stay here. A second after Suggs said that Ray was quoted as saying, "I don't play less, so I don't take less. That's life." Rarely does an athlete take any sort of "hometown discount" these days, whatever that means anyway, and Suggs does not impress me as one who would. Case in point, for the thousandth time, we have offered him top tier money and he still has not signed. And I do not expect him to be at these minicamps, either, seeing how he has not signed his tender nor a long term extension yet. My point was, if YOU are sure he would take a "hometown discount," then why hasn't he signed? Why would it have taken a three player "hometown discount" package? Why all this quibbling when top tier money has been offered? Oh, and I also said it would have been plain dumb if Bart leaving for the Jets has somehow played into Suggs' contract squabbling, seeing how it is impossible to believe Suggs made the "hometown discount" statement to begin with. All players want to break the bank these days, and I believe Suggs is one of them. And while I feel he is good, I do not believe he is worth that type of money, which has been offered. That is just my opinion, and if you disagree, then fine...everyone is entitled to believe what they believe.
And again, if you have to eventually let a player go who thinks they are worth more than they are, then so be it. The Ravens have done that before, and it has worked.
I just hope Suggs doesn't get paid Haynesworth type money because it is just too much of a contract. I mean Haynesworth is a good player and all but a 100 million dollar contract is just outrageous and I somehow don't think he's gonna be in Washington for very long since the redskins are not close of even contending for the Super Bowl. If Suggs doesn't get his contract extension before the season starts, well it could motivate him to have a breakout season and he'll finally break the bank soon enough.
I missed NFL Total Access--can you (Dan) or someone report on what Suggs said last night?
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Sam,
I DVRed it, was all ready to watch it this morning and report back, and then...nothing. Suggs didn't appear at all on the show. Don't know if he was a no-show or if there was just a false internet report or something, but unfortunately we don't get to hear Sizzle's side on the contract talks just yet. Sorry, man.
-Dan
Too bad. Here is a question for you (or anyone else who wants to weigh in): my opinion is that if Suggs wants Haynesworth type money (and I don't really know that he does or doesn't), then the FO should have known that (or something along those lines--if a guy is really that money hungry, it seems to me that it should be obvious by the time you've negotiated with him and his agent for 2 or so years) by the time they had to designate a franchise player. They should, in that case, have either sewn up Bart Scott to a LT contract or designated him the franchise player. He was obviously amenable to contract that called for less money than Haynesworth even if not giving a "hometown (or Superbowl) discount," and obviously thrives in the Ravens' defense. Now, Suggs is younger, bigger and faster than Scott is and has been a better pass rusher, but--Scott is still a fine player, and although some internet chatter has him not doing as well with the Jets as he did with the Ravens, he is clearly ready, willing and able to assume leadership of that defense and show guys how Rex's defense is done. He won't have guys like Ray and Ed around (not to mention a number of other seriously talented players--I am definitely not trying to disrespect anyone here, but those two are the generally acknowledged "coaches on the field") to help him, so maybe he won't do as well, but he would have done, IMHO, even better if Suggs had been the one to go to the Jets rather than him, and more responsibility had been put on Bart's shoulders. Especially if he had become the "heir apparent" to Ray over the next couple of years.
So, what do readers of this blog think--mistake to make Suggs the franchise player rather than Scott, or not? I mean, assuming that Sizzle wants more money than a responsible franchise will give even its top players.
Hey Dan, I was asking you the question about Sizzle/Scott too!
If you want to comment on it, anyway.
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Sam,
Sure...first of all, I didn't mean to imply that Suggs IS asking for Haynesworth-type money, only that if he plans on scoring a mega-monster contract, he might not get it here. Still, the negotiations have a ways to go and the Ravens are hopefull a deal will eventually get done. Suggs and Scott are two very different types of players, so it's tough to compare the two in terms of what they provide on the field. But I will say this: elite pass-rushers are very hard to come by, and the Ravens have one in Suggs. He's just 26, and if they can get that deal done, AFC North QBs won't be sleeping much the night before coming into M&T.
-Dan
Sam,
While it may have been nice to see what Scott would have done as the so-called "leader" or "man" of the defense had we retained him and not Ray, I honestly think we will be okay without him. We drafted Tavares last year in the third round for a reason, and you have to see what you have in certain players. The Ravens always seem to find capable reinforcements at linebacker, and with a gem from last year in McClain going into his second year, Jason Phillips and others, we have tremendous depth this season. I also think it was much more important to sign Ray. He may not be a four down backer anymore, but his tenacity, preparedness and leadership are still tops in the league. No one in the NFL has those same qualities all-in-one that Ray has. I think it became clear we were not going to be able to keep both Scott and Ray, and I would take Ray any day, even at this late stage in his career, simply because of what he brings away from the field. He gets EVERYONE up to play.
As for Suggs, while you make some good points, I feel it is tough to compare his situation to that of Bart's. They play different positions, Suggs is younger and more athletic and like I said before, you can't put a premium on a good pass rusher. I just wish he would sign already!! Hey, I would have love to have kept all three guys, but I honestly feel the right player got away. Let's see how Scott does without Ray, Ed, Haloti and others around him. He might be the next player to have left and not do anything...see Hartwell, Weaver, Herring, Starks, etc.
Josh and Dan, thanks for your comments. I think we're pretty much in agreement. My point about signing Bart rather than Suggs was only made on the basis of the hypothetical that Suggs wants a bigger contract than a sane management that wants to spread the money around to many deserving players will give. Yes, it's tough to compare the two, but--if we lose Terrell next year, we don't have either one. As for the new guys--it will certainly be good if they step up, but obviously Ozzie was willing to give Bart a heap of money to stay (unless he was just doing Bart a favor by bidding up his price to the Jets--I suppose that's always possible, he knows Rex and knows how far Rex would go to get players who are familiar with his defensive scheme--a going away present to Bart), so I wonder if he has the same confidence in the younger guys that you have. We'll soon see. Can't wait to see Kelly and Haloti play together--will that be cool or what? An unmovable wall to keep that 100 yard running streak going! But the linebackers have to be able to their part too to make it work.
I agree with Josh's points about Ray--I would just add that, as some people noted back when rumors had him going another team, his leadership on the Ravens most likely wouldn't have transferred very well in another setting with other veterans not used to his inimitable vocal style.
Anyway, it's all speculation. What is, is. Let's just finally get Sizzle happily signed so we don't have to go through this little dance again!