Sano apparently a no-go
The international signing period began today, with teams allowed to reach contractual agreements with amateur free agents from Latin America. But Andy MacPhail, president of baseball operations, told me a few minutes ago that I shouldn't look for anything to happen in the immediate future.
The Orioles spent three days working out 16-year-old shortstop Miguel Sano, and a handful of teams are believed to be interested in him.
There's just one issue, beyond the uncertainty over how he'd perform in actual games: Major League Baseball is investigating whether Sano is a few years older than his listed age.
If that's the case, Sano won't be allowed to leave the Dominican. And he was in line for a huge signing bonus - early reports had his agent seeking around $5 million - so there's an obvious financial risk while his situation is unsettled. That could scare off some clubs.
It's certainly not helping Sano that the investigation is dragging along.
Sano and 16-year-old Dominican outfielder Wagner Mateo were considered the top two talents on the market. Mateo just signed with the St. Louis Cardinals. His bonus is reportedly around $3 million.
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Categories (click for archive)Roch Kubatko | Roch Kubatko Orioles |
As badly the orioles need a short stop in the future - I heard the signing bonus and I thought the orioles willnot spend that kind of money for him. So maybe that is another player that the redsox or yankees may get!
sad...
That's okay. MacPhail is probably waiting to sign Aroldis Champan.
Right...? RIGHT?
This International FA is so screwed up its like getting an extra first round pick in the draft + signing bonus. Its an extra draft and a way to get a leg up on the competition. The Yanks use it (so its not that big of a deal they never have a top 15 draft pick). I would hope we would do the same.
*wakes up from dream*
Roch:
MacPhail didn't rule him out completely, did he?
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No. And I hope I didn't give that impression. I apologize if that's the case. I just know the club isn't expected to sign anyone anytime soon. And everyone is waiting to see what happens with Sano. - Roch
Interesting thought I just had....Thought I'd share!
I have never heard of this, but could the Orioles offer Sano 4.5 million. In the contract, if he ever turns out to be older than he is he has to return a set amount of money. Possibly even go 5 million if that is able to be written into the contract!
Not saying the O's should get him, but how come he won't be able to leave the Dominican if it's discovered he's older than 16?
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Visa issue? Not really sure. I'm doing a search to find more info. But the problem would be falsifying certificate, not that he's older than 16. - Roch
Hey Roch, have you heard of any interest the Orioles have in Aroldis Chapman the Cuban defector who they are calling the best left handed pitcher in the world?
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Haven't heard his name tossed around. - Roch
Just throwing this out there, knowing that it will re-open the "signability" wound. Perhaps the Orioles drafted Hobgood knowing that he wouldn't need as much to sign as a guy like Wheeler, with the intent to sign Sano as well? MLBtraderumors.com is posting that the Orioles may be willing to outbid the Pirates for Sano's services, and the Pirates are believed to be in the lead for him. Knowing how difficult it may be to sign Mychal Givens, signing Sano may just be a safety net for them.
This would be a very nice surprise, it if happens. Of course, I'd also like to see them go hard after Chapman too!
AWESOME, The Orioles spend way too much time and effort scouting in the West Indies. Our history of good talent from that region is horrible. All one has to do is remember "greats" like Daniel Cabrera, R. Hernandez, Louis Hernandez, Aider Torrez, R. Liz, (Do you want me to keep going or do you get my point) With a population base of nearly 400 million, scout the UNITED STATES, and save the West Indies for cheap jewelry and liquor....
I thought the penalty for lying about your age was a 1 year suspension. Also, just a rumor, but I also read somewhere that the oldest Sano would likely be, would be 18. Meaning that he would not be able to get started here until he was 19. That's still pretty young, so the question then becomes, is he as an 18 year old (basically a HS senior depending on when you are born) worth Top 5 draft pick money and a year out of the game? I know Stocksill (sp?) was very high on him as being extremely developed (both physically and as a player) for a kid his age.
My question is whether or not signing Sano would give us a leg up on getting Gyvens (again sp?, sorry) signed.
It would be great to have 2 great prospects at SS in the minors though... if Sano is a little older, might he be switchable to 3B? Not saying for the immediate future...but if they were about the same age and were both signed...I think you see where I'm going...
Roch, two questions for you, if you happen to know.
1) Do you think McPhail means that the possibity of signing Sano is on hold till his age is verified, or that the O's are out either way?
2)Why is his age such a big question compared to other Latin prospects? A lot of guys have signed already today without such intense scrutiny.
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MacPhail only commented on the fact that the Orioles aren't expecting to sign anyone in the immediate future. I don't think they've closed the door on Sano. They really like him. But his current situation is putting a lot of teams on hold. It's fair to assume the Orioles are included. I heard there already was some apprehension because they hadn't seen him play in any real games. Now we have the age issue. As for the scrutiny, MLB found reason to investigate him. The ages of the others apparently have already been confirmed. - Roch
Why bother trying the kid out for three days if you know you are not going to pony up the money to sign him? Is it just a show to placate the fans that know enough to know the O's should be making an effort down there?
This is the 2nd ISP that AM has had a chance to prepare for and if the O's want to realisticlly compete with the Sox and the Yanks they need to start doing more down there then signing cheap guys that lighting might strike with.
The O's went cheap with thier #1 pick this year. While the boat is still out on the overall draft class I will be very unhappy if the O's are spending less on Draft/International talent then last year.
I commend the Orioles for this courageous decision. Andy MacPhail does not need to sign any corrupt liars who falsify their ages. People like that are poison. Miguel Tejada is evidence of that. We already had one of those types pass through Baltimore and do not need anymore. If a player lies about his age, what else will he do? Cheat? Steal? Kill? No thank you. The trolls can shove any bashes they were about to type down their pieholes instead.
I don't think there is a legal way for the O's to sign him and then have him give back money if he lied about his age. They would likely have to sue him for fraud, and then they might have to do it in Dominican courts rather than American.
This issue about his age does not make him any less talented. What it does make him is not worth a $4MM signing bonus. Also, according to a website for the Vietnamese Consulate I found when googling, lying on a visa application may make you permanently ineligible for future visas. So, it is possible that if he is found to have applied for a visa knowingly lying about his birthday the US is within their legal rights to deny him entry into the country FOREVER. They have done the same thing to Dominican (and other Carribean) players who have been found guilty of bringing females to the U.S. under sham marriages. After the Smiley Gonzalez fiasco, where the Nationals ended up being out $1.4MM, teams are much more careful with players who are commanding high dollar bonuses.
I read somewhere that a baseball person in the know said that if he had been eligible for this year's draft, Sano would have been a sure first round pick and could have gone as high as 4th. There is no doubt that he is talented. It's all about the age now. I wonder if the Orioles can recover money from MLB if they clear him and then it is discovered that he is older than thought.
A couple of points. First the prospect has to prove his age - mlb does not need to disprove it. Second if he has lied about his age he will not be able to participate in major/minor league baseball associated programs for one year.
The Cuban lefthander just defected 36 hours ago ,until he has a country of residency and is okayed by the State Department there is nothing to talk about.
JJ - seems natural to me that they would be more careful before risking a $5M bonus check than a $25 thousand dollar bonus check
MSTR - I see no reason why they cant sign a contingent contract with age confirmation as one continency. Put money in escrow pending completion of the leagues testing. Put lesser amount at risk but tie him up prior to the test to ward off other teams. Not sure why you think this would be problematic.
If Sano is possibly an AgeGate player then it's prudent to be cautious. It isn't out of the realm of possibility. It happens all the time. Miguel Tejada aged 2 years right after we dealt him. If Sano were 18, then his skills are evaluated differently, and his signing bonus completely changes.
mstrchef13: Pete could structure the deal legally. I wouldn't pay him anything until the issue is thoroughly vetted, but a contract can condition payment on pretty much anything.
Roch: FYI, I think the confusion about the O's "closing the door" comes from the headline to this blog -- "no-go" usually means "not going to happen", that a decision has been made to not pursue him.